Post by The Supreme Emissary on Oct 26, 2015 2:49:59 GMT -5
The following is a collection of ideas and concepts for developing a new Kill Team format. This is going to look like a word jumble then get more refined over time. Ask any questions and pitch any ideas you think will help contribute.
What do we cut out from the codexes? What is not appropriate to field in a small model count infantry based game type?
No unique characters. No Lords of War. No Artillery. No Relics.
No Monstrous creatures? No Vehicles? No Fortifications (Buildings for sure)?
Generic HQs must be individually considered. Psykers need their abilities modified to fit the format.
What needs to stay the same?
unit profiles, barring player upgrades. Model costs. Weapon and war gear profiles need to stay as close to the same as possible. WYSISWYG models should be naturally encouraged but can't be a deal breaker.
Factions / Army Lists
Adepta Sororitas
Adeptus Arbites
Adeptus Astartes + Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Grey Knights, Space Wolves, Black Templars, Deathwatch
Adeptus Mechanicus
Astra Militarum
Chaos Daemons
Chaos Space Marines
Eldar + Dark Eldar, Harlequins, Corsairs
Inquisition
Tyranids + Genestealer Cult
All new Kill Team lists should start with a minimum of 5 TROOP models with 100 points.
Effects should be categorized by base to base, templates, single model or the entire army.
One model is always the Team Leader. It can be any model < the model with the highest Ld < the model with the most EXP. The Leader applies his Ld stat to the whole army. He also generates more EXP when he kills or is killed.
Models represent characters that start as the most logical and appropriate basic trooper. They then buy upgrades to stats, gear and abilities that can change them into something else. When a character is first created the player can spend as many points as available on upgrades rather than waiting to level them up individually.
Example: Space marines start as scouts until they are modified and enhanced into full marines. A new kill team of marines is based on a squad of 5 scouts but they can either remain scouts or be upgraded individually to tactical marines before the first game with excess points.
EXP is awarded at the end of game and translated into upgrade points. VP is awarded for for the usual objectives and characters earn bonus points for what they kill.
Players are not going to play to grind points. They are going to play to win. If they don't think there's a chance to win evenly or if they don't think they have a sure victory, they won't play. A unique challenge may entice them but that can't be calculated.
---
Example Marine Progression
Scout 11p - Sniper +1p - Gunner +8p - Missileer +15p - Veteran +10p / Scout Sgt
Tac Marine 14p - Specialist / Heavy / Jump / bike / Centurion - Veteran +10p / Tac Sgt
Veteran - Vanguard / Sternguard / Terminator / Vet Sgt / Termi Sgt
Champion / Apothecary / Standard Bearer
Honour Guard / Champion / Standard Bearer
Librarian / Chaplain / Techmarine + Servitors + Shield/Turret
---
Example Sororitas Progression
Battle Sister 12p - Veteran +10p / Dominion / Retributor
Hospitaler / Dialogus
Celestian 14p / Repentia 14p - Mistress / Seraphim 15p
Ministorum Priest 25p + Arco-flagellant 10p / Death Cult Assassin 15p / Crusader 15p
---
Example AdMech Progression
Ranger / Vanguard - Alpha + Dragoon / Ironstrider
Ruststalker / Infiltrator - Princep
Electro Priests
Datasmith / Tech Priest + Servitors - Kataphron
---
Example Eldar Progression
Guardians Storm/Defenders 9p + Heavy Weapon Platform / Windrider
Ranger
Dire Avengers / Howling Banshee / Striking Scorpion / Fire Dragon / Swooping Hawk / Warp Spider / Shining Spear / Dark Reaper + Exarch
Wraith Guard/blade
Warlock 35p
---
Example Dark Eldar Progression
Kabalite Warrior - Sybarite + Trueborn - Dracon / Wych - Hekatrix + Bloodbride - Syren
Hellions - Helliarch / Beast Master + Khymera 10p / Razorwing Flock 20p / Clawed Fiend 30p
Reaver - Arena Champion
Incubi - Klaivex
Mandrake - Nightfiend
Scourge - Solarite
Wrack - Acothyst / Grotesque
Lhamaean 10p / Ur-Ghul 15p / Medusae 25p / Sslyth 25p
---
Example Harlequin Progression
Player - Troupe Master
Skyweavers
Death Jester / Shadowseer
---
Example Tyranid Progression
Spore mines / Mucolid
Rippers / Sky-slasher
Termagant / Hormagaunt / Gargoyle
Genestealer - Broodlord
Tyranid Warrior / Shrike / Raveners - Tyranid Prime
Hive Guard
Biovore
Lictor
Zoanthrope
Venomthrope - Neurothrope
---
Example Tau Progression
Drones / Drone Sentry Turret
Fire Warrior / Breacher - Shas'ui + Tactical Support Turret
Pathfinder - Sash'ui
Sniper Drone Team
Stealth Suit / Crisis Suit + bodyguard / Broadside Suit - Shas'ui
Ethereal / Fireblade / Commander
---
Example Imperial Guard Progression
Infantry Platoon [Command Squad, Infantry Squads, Heavy Weapon Squads, Special Weapon Squad, Conscripts]
Tempestus Platoon [Command Squad, Scions]
Veterans / Company Command Squad
Commissar - Lord Commissar / Ministorum Priest / Primaris Psyker / Enginseer + Servitors
Ogryn, Bullgryn / Ratling / Wyrdvane Psyker / Rough Riders
Sentinels
---
Example Chaos Marines Progression
Cultists
Chaos Marines / Khorne Berserkers / Thousand Sons / Plague Marines / Noise Marines / Biker / Raptor / Warp Talon / Havocs
Chosen / Terminators
Possessed / Obliterators / Mutilators / Chaos Spawn
Chaos Lord / Sorcerer / Warpsmith / Dark Apostle
-----
Legions and Chapter Tactics
Ultramarines (Angels Revenant), Iron Hands, Imperial Fists (Executioners), Raven Guard (Raptors), Salamanders, White Scars (mantis Warriors)
Dark Angels (Deathwing, Ravenwing), Blood Angels, Space Wolves, Grey Knights
Red Scorpions, Carcharodons, Red Hunters, Star Phantoms, Minotaurs, Fire Hawks, Astral Claws
Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, World Eaters, Night Lords, Emperor's Children, Alpha Legion, Sons of Horus
Chaos Chapter Tactics
Forge World Chapter Tactics
Ultramarines- Combat doctrines (Tactical, Assault, Devastator) The whole army gains twin-linked in the shooting phase, assault phase or during overwatch. Each are one use only.
White Scars - (Born in the Saddle, Fight on the Move)
Imperial Fists - (Bolter Drill) The Siege Masters bonuses won't really be applicable
Black Templars - (Holy Crusaders, Lost Librarius, Righteous Zeal) cannot be joined by any allied psykers
Iron Hands - (The Flesh is Weak, Machine Empathy) look at the value of Techs
Salamanders - (Flamecraft) Master Artisan lets one of the team leaders weapons count as master crafted
Raven Guard - (Strike from the Shadows, Winged Deliverance)
Dark Angels - Prefered Enemy (Chaos Marines) and Grim Resolve. Deathwing or Ravenwing.
Blood Angels -
Space Wolves - Acute Senses, Counter Attack. Can add Fenrisian Wolves as cavalry and/or Beasts.
Grey Knights -
Red Scorpions - Sgt characters get free nartheciums. may re-roll pinning tests. Cannot go to ground or take camo cloaks.
Carcharadons - Everyone has Fear. If a model kills an enemy in assault phase it gains Rage.
Raptors - Non-bulky models have scout and stealth for the first round. Models that don't move may gain rending with bolt guns and bolt pistols (including combi-)
Mantis Warriors - Everyone has Move Through Cover, Hammer of Wrath and gain furious charge if they charge out of terrain cover. May re-roll Seize the Initiative.
Executioners - Ignore debuffs to Ld. The Team Leader has Instant Death on CC wounds of 6.
Angels Revenant - Prefered Enemy necrons, Hatred necrons. If half your models are lost the rest gain Fearless.
Red Hunters - Adamantium will. Can choose to add another special rule at game start.
Star Phantoms - Once per game for one shooting phase, all weapons are twin-linked. Something to do with deep strike reserves.
Minotaurs - Don't panic, may re-roll pinning tests. Everyone has Crusader and add +1 to charge rolls.
Fire Hawks - Flamers get +1S. Hammor of Wrath attacks from jump troops get +1S. Hand flamers are available for 5p as a 'Ranged Weapon' option.
Astral Claws/Red Corsairs - Everyone is stubborn. Bikes gain skilled Rider and Scout.
Alpha Legion - all models have stubborn, d3 models gain infiltrate
Black Legion - Preferred enemy (Space marines). Something to do with Chosen, making them cheaper or easier to get or giving them some kind of bodyguard rules.
Iron Warriors - Something about adding War Smiths more easily. Something to do with getting heavy support choices in as the main compliment.
Night Lords - Everyone has Fear. Raptors are easier to get.
Word Bearers - Can get Dark Apostles more easily, like the Iron Warriors War Smiths. Everyone has Zealot.
-----
Upgrade stats
Everyone should be able to upgrade one of their profile stats by +1 by spending points. They can then be further improved by adding abilities or changing specialties.
What do we cut out from the codexes? What is not appropriate to field in a small model count infantry based game type?
No unique characters. No Lords of War. No Artillery. No Relics.
No Monstrous creatures? No Vehicles? No Fortifications (Buildings for sure)?
Generic HQs must be individually considered. Psykers need their abilities modified to fit the format.
What needs to stay the same?
unit profiles, barring player upgrades. Model costs. Weapon and war gear profiles need to stay as close to the same as possible. WYSISWYG models should be naturally encouraged but can't be a deal breaker.
Factions / Army Lists
Adepta Sororitas
Adeptus Arbites
Adeptus Astartes + Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Grey Knights, Space Wolves, Black Templars, Deathwatch
Adeptus Mechanicus
Astra Militarum
Chaos Daemons
Chaos Space Marines
Eldar + Dark Eldar, Harlequins, Corsairs
Inquisition
Tyranids + Genestealer Cult
All new Kill Team lists should start with a minimum of 5 TROOP models with 100 points.
Effects should be categorized by base to base, templates, single model or the entire army.
One model is always the Team Leader. It can be any model < the model with the highest Ld < the model with the most EXP. The Leader applies his Ld stat to the whole army. He also generates more EXP when he kills or is killed.
Models represent characters that start as the most logical and appropriate basic trooper. They then buy upgrades to stats, gear and abilities that can change them into something else. When a character is first created the player can spend as many points as available on upgrades rather than waiting to level them up individually.
Example: Space marines start as scouts until they are modified and enhanced into full marines. A new kill team of marines is based on a squad of 5 scouts but they can either remain scouts or be upgraded individually to tactical marines before the first game with excess points.
EXP is awarded at the end of game and translated into upgrade points. VP is awarded for for the usual objectives and characters earn bonus points for what they kill.
Players are not going to play to grind points. They are going to play to win. If they don't think there's a chance to win evenly or if they don't think they have a sure victory, they won't play. A unique challenge may entice them but that can't be calculated.
---
Example Marine Progression
Scout 11p - Sniper +1p - Gunner +8p - Missileer +15p - Veteran +10p / Scout Sgt
Tac Marine 14p - Specialist / Heavy / Jump / bike / Centurion - Veteran +10p / Tac Sgt
Veteran - Vanguard / Sternguard / Terminator / Vet Sgt / Termi Sgt
Champion / Apothecary / Standard Bearer
Honour Guard / Champion / Standard Bearer
Librarian / Chaplain / Techmarine + Servitors + Shield/Turret
---
Example Sororitas Progression
Battle Sister 12p - Veteran +10p / Dominion / Retributor
Hospitaler / Dialogus
Celestian 14p / Repentia 14p - Mistress / Seraphim 15p
Ministorum Priest 25p + Arco-flagellant 10p / Death Cult Assassin 15p / Crusader 15p
---
Example AdMech Progression
Ranger / Vanguard - Alpha + Dragoon / Ironstrider
Ruststalker / Infiltrator - Princep
Electro Priests
Datasmith / Tech Priest + Servitors - Kataphron
---
Example Eldar Progression
Guardians Storm/Defenders 9p + Heavy Weapon Platform / Windrider
Ranger
Dire Avengers / Howling Banshee / Striking Scorpion / Fire Dragon / Swooping Hawk / Warp Spider / Shining Spear / Dark Reaper + Exarch
Wraith Guard/blade
Warlock 35p
---
Example Dark Eldar Progression
Kabalite Warrior - Sybarite + Trueborn - Dracon / Wych - Hekatrix + Bloodbride - Syren
Hellions - Helliarch / Beast Master + Khymera 10p / Razorwing Flock 20p / Clawed Fiend 30p
Reaver - Arena Champion
Incubi - Klaivex
Mandrake - Nightfiend
Scourge - Solarite
Wrack - Acothyst / Grotesque
Lhamaean 10p / Ur-Ghul 15p / Medusae 25p / Sslyth 25p
---
Example Harlequin Progression
Player - Troupe Master
Skyweavers
Death Jester / Shadowseer
---
Example Tyranid Progression
Spore mines / Mucolid
Rippers / Sky-slasher
Termagant / Hormagaunt / Gargoyle
Genestealer - Broodlord
Tyranid Warrior / Shrike / Raveners - Tyranid Prime
Hive Guard
Biovore
Lictor
Zoanthrope
Venomthrope - Neurothrope
---
Example Tau Progression
Drones / Drone Sentry Turret
Fire Warrior / Breacher - Shas'ui + Tactical Support Turret
Pathfinder - Sash'ui
Sniper Drone Team
Stealth Suit / Crisis Suit + bodyguard / Broadside Suit - Shas'ui
Ethereal / Fireblade / Commander
---
Example Imperial Guard Progression
Infantry Platoon [Command Squad, Infantry Squads, Heavy Weapon Squads, Special Weapon Squad, Conscripts]
Tempestus Platoon [Command Squad, Scions]
Veterans / Company Command Squad
Commissar - Lord Commissar / Ministorum Priest / Primaris Psyker / Enginseer + Servitors
Ogryn, Bullgryn / Ratling / Wyrdvane Psyker / Rough Riders
Sentinels
---
Example Chaos Marines Progression
Cultists
Chaos Marines / Khorne Berserkers / Thousand Sons / Plague Marines / Noise Marines / Biker / Raptor / Warp Talon / Havocs
Chosen / Terminators
Possessed / Obliterators / Mutilators / Chaos Spawn
Chaos Lord / Sorcerer / Warpsmith / Dark Apostle
-----
Legions and Chapter Tactics
Ultramarines (Angels Revenant), Iron Hands, Imperial Fists (Executioners), Raven Guard (Raptors), Salamanders, White Scars (mantis Warriors)
Dark Angels (Deathwing, Ravenwing), Blood Angels, Space Wolves, Grey Knights
Red Scorpions, Carcharodons, Red Hunters, Star Phantoms, Minotaurs, Fire Hawks, Astral Claws
Iron Warriors, Word Bearers, World Eaters, Night Lords, Emperor's Children, Alpha Legion, Sons of Horus
Chaos Chapter Tactics
Forge World Chapter Tactics
Ultramarines- Combat doctrines (Tactical, Assault, Devastator) The whole army gains twin-linked in the shooting phase, assault phase or during overwatch. Each are one use only.
White Scars - (Born in the Saddle, Fight on the Move)
Imperial Fists - (Bolter Drill) The Siege Masters bonuses won't really be applicable
Black Templars - (Holy Crusaders, Lost Librarius, Righteous Zeal) cannot be joined by any allied psykers
Iron Hands - (The Flesh is Weak, Machine Empathy) look at the value of Techs
Salamanders - (Flamecraft) Master Artisan lets one of the team leaders weapons count as master crafted
Raven Guard - (Strike from the Shadows, Winged Deliverance)
Dark Angels - Prefered Enemy (Chaos Marines) and Grim Resolve. Deathwing or Ravenwing.
Blood Angels -
Space Wolves - Acute Senses, Counter Attack. Can add Fenrisian Wolves as cavalry and/or Beasts.
Grey Knights -
Red Scorpions - Sgt characters get free nartheciums. may re-roll pinning tests. Cannot go to ground or take camo cloaks.
Carcharadons - Everyone has Fear. If a model kills an enemy in assault phase it gains Rage.
Raptors - Non-bulky models have scout and stealth for the first round. Models that don't move may gain rending with bolt guns and bolt pistols (including combi-)
Mantis Warriors - Everyone has Move Through Cover, Hammer of Wrath and gain furious charge if they charge out of terrain cover. May re-roll Seize the Initiative.
Executioners - Ignore debuffs to Ld. The Team Leader has Instant Death on CC wounds of 6.
Angels Revenant - Prefered Enemy necrons, Hatred necrons. If half your models are lost the rest gain Fearless.
Red Hunters - Adamantium will. Can choose to add another special rule at game start.
Star Phantoms - Once per game for one shooting phase, all weapons are twin-linked. Something to do with deep strike reserves.
Minotaurs - Don't panic, may re-roll pinning tests. Everyone has Crusader and add +1 to charge rolls.
Fire Hawks - Flamers get +1S. Hammor of Wrath attacks from jump troops get +1S. Hand flamers are available for 5p as a 'Ranged Weapon' option.
Astral Claws/Red Corsairs - Everyone is stubborn. Bikes gain skilled Rider and Scout.
Alpha Legion - all models have stubborn, d3 models gain infiltrate
Black Legion - Preferred enemy (Space marines). Something to do with Chosen, making them cheaper or easier to get or giving them some kind of bodyguard rules.
Iron Warriors - Something about adding War Smiths more easily. Something to do with getting heavy support choices in as the main compliment.
Night Lords - Everyone has Fear. Raptors are easier to get.
Word Bearers - Can get Dark Apostles more easily, like the Iron Warriors War Smiths. Everyone has Zealot.
-----
Upgrade stats
Everyone should be able to upgrade one of their profile stats by +1 by spending points. They can then be further improved by adding abilities or changing specialties.